BusAndTrainUser Verify

Tuesday 23rd April 2024

Welcome to another investigation into a sensational public transport headline from the mainstream media.

Way back on 11th October last year BBC News carried a story stating “more than 500 people have signed a petition to save a bus stop in Cornwall set to be removed due to safety concerns”.

It was a bus stop I knew (and loved) well – the terminal point for buses serving the picturesque fishing community of Fowey where, according to the BBC “the area has been used as a pick-up point for passengers in Fowey for more than 100 years” which was one aspect of the story that definitely rang true; but the rest of the story all seemed a bit odd to me, so it’s been sitting in my “must verify this in a blog, one day” pending file for months ….. until today.

The story stated residents are opposed to the stop’s move because “an alternative stop on Hanson Drive .…. being in a less safe location with no shelter, seating or live travel updates”.

One resident Gretchen Viehmann said the stop had a “natural logic” as “a terminus for the bus services” and she was not sure why it had “suddenly become an issue“.

Gretchen is no stranger to the media. She’s Head of Documentary & Editorial Photography at Falmouth University and has been the Director of Photography for both the New York Post and the New York Daily News.

The story was followed up on 19th October with an explanation from Richard Stevens, managing director of Go Cornwall who said the change to the terminus arrangement was “not made lightly” but “safety considerations” including “numerous incidents since 2020 involving near misses and more seriously crushing the bench outside the pub on multiple occasions.”

That must be some crushed bench.

Even more dramatic “the final occasion there were people sitting on the bench. This is an unacceptable risk,” Richard unsurprisingly added.

When reading these stories last October something didn’t seem right to me. Firstly, the summer 2023 timetable for Go Cornwall’s hourly route 25 showed the terminal point had been moved to a new site at the town’s Readymoney car park (that really is it’s name) from April that year, so the BBC news story in October was somewhat dated and its references to “Go Cornwall is set to remove the stop in Fowey from January” (2024) wide of the mark – by nine months.

Route 25 timetable: April 2022 (left) and April 2023 (right) note the Fowey terminal change

Secondly, to add to the intrigue, First Kernow’s hourly route 24 which also serves Fowey continued to turn round outside the Safe Harbour Hotel, and still does to this day, and, I assume people continue to sit on the bench.

I finally managed to find the time to pop down to Cornwall and visit the delightful Safe Harbour Hotel terminal point in Fowey last Thursday to establish whether Safe Harbour really is safe and have a look at that alternative “less safe” stop without “shelter, seating or live travel updates“.

I travelled to Fowey on Go Cornwall’s long hourly route 25 which links Newquay with St Austell, Par and Fowey and planned to return on First Kernow’s route 24 which also links the town with Par and St Austell albeit using a more direct route as far as Par.

Here’s a map to show the location of the controversial terminus point outside the Safe Harbour Hotel as well as the extended route followed by Go Cornwall’s buses for the past 12 months to the replacement terminus at Readymoney car park.

Two things may strike you from the map. Firstly the short distance from the Safe Harbour Hotel bus stop to the alleged “less safe” bus stop from where route 25 now continues its route along Hanson Drive, illustrated more clearly in the following map in red.

It’s 160 yards.

And secondly the thought that quite a few houses along the 0.6 mile route extension along Hanson Drive and Tower Park might benefit from the four bus stops along that road now served by the 25.

And indeed that is the case. Residents no longer have a lengthy walk to the Safe Harbour Hotel terminus. Here are all the houses now better served, highlighted by Google’s satellite.

Quite apart from any safety concerns at the Safe Harbour Hotel, an extension of the route seems like a very good idea for residents wanting to access St Austell for example. There is a Fowey Town Bus which connects the car park with the “town centre”.

It even has its own Facebook page

… and is particularly popular with tourists arriving by car in the summer.

I alighted from the bus on route 25 at the bus stop just before where Hanson Drive starts, along with the other four passengers on the bus, which then continued with no-one on to Readymoney car park.

The above maps don’t convey the steep and narrow incline of the road leading down to the Safe Harbour Hotel so here are a few photographs to illustrate the scene. The first shows the bus on route 25 continuing on to Hanson Drive at the point where buses on route 24 turn left through the ‘No Motor Vehicles except for access’ signs and immediately turn right in front of the white building.

Buses then take the narrow left hand fork marked “Town – Esplanade”.

To arrive alongside the Safe Harbour Hotel.

The bus can’t go any further, and the controversial bus stop is marked with a flag on the No Motor Vehicles pole together with a timetable case and yellow markings on the road immediately outside the hotel.

As you can see, not only are there two benches outside the hotel (one of which looks rather new), which the bus reverses in front of to reach the yellow road marking bus stop, someone was enjoying a pint in the afternoon sunshine while someone else had parked their mobility scooter outside.

It’s a lovely spot, especially on a beautiful sunny afternoon. One of the quietest and most peaceful bus termini you could find.

But is it safe?

There’s no doubt the First Kernow bus driver I witnessed was well experienced in how to enact the reverse manoeuvre. He pulled over to his right as he passed the hotel.

Then reversed hard left to reach the bus stop marking.

The man on the bench didn’t flinch. And a passenger waiting for the bus knew to wait by the bus stop pole/flag rather than by the road marking.

She was joined by another passenger and boarded the bus – the driver having conveniently lined the door up with the road junction.

Whereas route 24 used to run hourly from Fowey via St Austell to Mevagissey and the Lost Gardens of Heligan…

… this summer’s timetable has seen the route split in St Austell with the Fowey leg (still numbered 24) reduced to a 90 minute frequency with only seven journeys a day.

Safe Harbour Hotel’s terminus has therefore gone from 29 bus reversing manoeuvres a day up until April 2023 (including one at midnight) on both routes 24 and 25 down to just seven now.

But is it safe? If it’s not, then even one dangerous reversing manoeuvre is one too many.

The use of reversing horns and the fitting of rear cameras, giving bus drivers a clear view of what they’re reversing into, would certainly be essential aids I’d insist on to ensure risks are minimised.

Take a look at the video below and see what you think.

And yes, I nearly did get run over in the process.

And finally, as for that alternative “less safe” bus stop that’s 160 yards away “with no shelter, seating or live travel updates” – here it is with a passenger boarding as I left Fowey’s Safe Harbour Hotel on route 24. I’m sure I can see a bus shelter complete with a seat.

And I must have failed to spot the real time sign (giving “live travel updates”) at the Safe Harbour terminus. Some chance. There wasn’t even a mobile signal.

Sadly I suspect there’s no place for nostalgia for a bygone era of idyllic bus turning arrangements at termini in beautiful Cornish coastal locations like Fowey when it comes to today’s risk averse culture and I suspect this terminus, even with its reduced number of buses, is on borrowed time.

Let’s hope the BBC report on any future developments both accurately and in a timely fashion.

Roger French

Blogging timetable: 06:00 TThS

Comments on today’s blog are welcome but please keep them relevant to the blog topic, avoid personal insults and add your name (or an identifier). Thank you.

26 thoughts on “BusAndTrainUser Verify

  1. I came across this terminus unexpectedly during a bus tour of the Cornish coast a few years ago. It did surprise me at the time and my first thought was that it was “unsafe”. But the whole area is very quiet with little or no other traffic and as you say it has been in use for 100 years!

    The alternative stop may be only 160 yards (146m) away, but passengers from Fowey centre will already have made the steep climb from the village itself to reach the Safe Harbour

    Jim Davies

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  2. Any reversing movement is potentially unsafe, and of course saved many services from being converted to one man operation for years. But, we are where we are, and if all reversing at terminals, and at many places en route for rural services were banned, a lot of people would be busless.

    It is just a matter of common sense, sadly lacking in many parts these days. But without a phone signal at this point (mercifully), at least people may actually be looking up and notice should a bus be bearing down upon them. Must say that pub bench does looks remarkably new, but after seeing the video, not sure how it’s predecessor got hit multiple times.

    But the changed arrangements, involving the welcome extension, no evening service and far fewer buses terminating at the Safe Harbour, should surely be good enough and now left alone.

    Terence Uden

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  3. What are the accident and injury stats for the “unsafe” stop? Is there a proven problem, or is it a case of “Well, it COULD happen, so just in case…..”. On a related topic, back in 1976 I made several trips on buses around Fowey and Golant operated by a tiny, fiercely independent company (I think it was essentially a one-man operation), with chocolate-and-cream livery and notices within the bus denouncing the evils of the big operators. I can’t for the life of me remember what they were called now – anybody know? I imagine the owner would have had something to say about all this! Graham L.

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  4. you ought to try the Reading Buses main line route 17. Does a U turn on at the Wokingham Road and a mini roundabout at the Bear Inn (Water Tower). The later is quite amusing at the Tilehurst end as the road has been specially widened to allow buses to turn, however motorists think it is a ‘cut the corner off about’ rather than a ‘roundabout’ and get caught out on the wrong side of it when buses start to turn.

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  5. I believe that the alternative stops, bereft of shelter etc., are the stops above the Safe Harbour on Hanson Drive, which are closer to the pub, as your map shows. They are on a straight road with good visibility of an approaching bus, rather than around the bend at your ‘sheltered’ stop. However, that’s a more contorted walking route from the town centre.

    But I can’t argue with the safety case made by Richard Stevens, even though the bus drivers meet the challenges of Cornwall’s roads with great skill and patience.

    Peter Murnaghan

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  6. I haven’t been to Cornwall since 2017, but saw similar manoeuvres at St Ives Royal Square where the Royal Buses service from the car parks terminated. This had the added bonus of pedestrians, parked cars and shop fronts. I don’t know if it’s changed now. This video will excite any health & safety fans!  https://youtu.be/xjM4wZaofnk?si=XmzN7Ao1-0zCmXZG

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    1. Apologies Roger. Didn’t intend to post it twice or be anonymous on that previous post. Think my wi-fi was delayed by a bus turning!

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    2. Current timetables still say “Royal Square – outside the Co-op”. Looks like the same place.

      Andrew Kleissner.

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  7. One thing not mentioned is the type of bus used. Our single deck bus of choice here is the ADL 200 MMC. Those have a larger turning circle than virtually any other, typically taking turnings much wider than double deckers. Marco A

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  8. With its occasionally narrow and steep roads and, in Summer, heavy traffic and levels of tourism, Cornwall must be a challenging place to operate. There’s a similar reversal outside a pub in Mousehole.

    I’m not sure that a visit in April is the best time to identify the danger or otherwise of the manoeuvre – why not go again in August to see how the driver gets on then?

    Paul B

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  9. Hello Roger. Coincidentally we were in Cornwall last week making extensive use of the Transport for Cornwall bus services which remain very good although they have been thinned out a bit from last year. We contemplated a visit to Fowey travelling via Polruan and the ferry, but decided against it due partly to the weather, partly because my wife and I can’t walk far these days, and certainly not up the hill to the bus stops at Safe Harbour Hotel or Hanson Drive. We were also uncertain about the 724 town bus service which is shown on Traveline as Tuesdays and Thursdays only and its not included in the Transport for Cornwall timetable book. Did you now find it running Monday to Friday as per the summer service? Perhaps a trip for next year in the summer!

    We did do a return trip on Route 481 from Looe to Polruan. It’s interesting route you may like to try. Its operated by a 16 seat minibus in TfC colours and takes you through very narrow country lanes, some remote villages and right down to the quay at Polruan. Reasonably well used, including three locals riding up from Polruan with their shopping to an estate at the top of the hill.

    Brian Willson (Orpington)

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  10. I’m very much not a local, but a couple of points spring to mind . . .

    1.  Roger’s video shows an E200MMC bus with 29 seats; these are the “baby” buses of the modern fleets, and as we see, manages to make the turn reasonably easily.
    2. The GoCornwall bus seen looks to be the same size, but are there larger buses in use on some journeys? I’d not like to turn a larger bus outside the hotel.

    Is that why each route has its own terminal working?  

    When I visited Fowey in March 2020 (two weeks before something else happened), all buses were terminating via Readymoney Car Park (fabulous name!), as there were roadworks outside the Hotel, which could have been necessary because the wall by the bus stop had been clobbered. Much like the Red Jet terminal in Cowes, there is probably just one way to make the turn, and an inexperienced driver could easily muck it up.

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  11. If something goes wrong it is the bus company and the driver who will face the consequences. You can have ‘olde worlde’ or present-day H&S – having both is a challenge!

    Terry

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  12. it’s really having to walk even further up the hill that is the main problem. If the 724 ran more regularly then it might not be such a problem. This is of course one place where the minibus revolution helped. The double deckers (including old London DMSs) on the 524 used to reverse at the Safe Harbour with no problem. But with the minibus revolution thr service was able to be extended right down the hill into the town, where a loop was operated to the west of the centre to turn. The move back to conventional size buses saw that useful service have to be cut back to the Safe Harbour, although school & college buses have terminated in the Hanson Drive Car Park for many years now. That stop you photographed at the top of the hill retained a Western Greyhound flag when I last visited a couple of years back. I have a photo of two Western Greyhound Solos parked alongside each other at the Safe Harbour, so cannot be that tight there.

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    1. Haven’t bollards been added restricting road space for buses to turn?

      Various reversing buses have hit the bench over the years.

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  13. Shades of remembering in tight places in Devon and Cornwall the Bristol LHS in Devon General/Western National Fleets with the angular front windowed Marshall Bodies. - Did they replace small Bristol SUs ? Also remember unions objecting to OMO operation in some places where a conductor would supervise a reversing turn , or where new single deckers were longer than the double decks they replaced. Typical challenge of running bus services really. 

    JBC Prestatyn

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  14. Thank you for posting from Fowey, a small village close to my heart. This is the first time I’ve posted a comment but have followed your blog for many years – it is excellent. Thank you for all the time, detail and insight you share.

    I have stayed in the town each of the last seven years and it has been interesting to see the bus types change and services adapt over the years. Part of the reason, supposed, for Go Cornwall Bus’ change was also to allow use of the longer Enviro200MMCs on the 25, which were not able to turn outside the Safe Harbour Hotel. Whether this is true or not, I do not know!

    The BBC article is also not technically wrong, but is out of date – during my visit last summer (and presumably the articles written in October 2023), that bus stop heading up New Road Hill is new and thus a positive development for the town – last year, there were streams of people waiting for the 25 at that particular bus stop, and I remember one particular day seeing a long line of passengers getting soaked in torrential late-July rain.

    Thanks for posting.

    James May (not that one)

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Many thanks for adding that interesting information James which contextualises comments about the “alternative bus stop” in the BBC story. And thanks for your kind comments about the blog.

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      1. Thank you Roger; I have re-read my comment and it is potentially a little ambiguous. The bus stop flag at New Road Hill was introduced when the 25 was diverted to Readymoney Cove car park and loop without any shelter; hence my anecdotal comment regarding the soaked passengers last year. The bus stop shelter is new since my last visit, as evidenced by your photos, which is a positive development.

        Also, regarding the real-time information, there is a stone / concrete shelter the other side of the old, traditional phone box (which has now been painted blue and green and is a book exchange) – I am fairly sure that there is an electronic screen with the live travel information in the shelter, but am not 100% on this information. It is also not immediately clear that there is this service available unless potential passengers do sit in the shelter as it is about 5 metres away from the bus stop slightly down the hill.

        Either way, thank you for posting. I agree that the 25 extended to Readymoney Cove car park and loop offers wider scope for the town and certainly better than the previous option when First used larger buses, which just terminated in Hanson Drive car park. The shelter is also only a short distance, as you say, from the Safe Harbour bus stop, and it certainly didn’t seem to cause any issues for passengers in terms of where to catch the bus during my visit last year, although I share the nostalgia of other comments for using the Safe Harbour stop.

        James

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    2. Yes, out there this morning is a full length 10.8m E200.

      Also, these days it doesn’t matter that the 25 and 29 are different operators. Period and return tickets are interchangeable.

      Steve

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  15. Recent (un-necessary) road alteration schemes to assist cyclists, for two connected junctions in Leicester have resulted in two stops moved further away from the junctions in case they hold up cars, one stop used to be right outside a health centre, now about 300 yards ( and now with no shelter! ) away. The other was close to a public house,also now 2 to 300 yards away. Leicester claims to be pro public transport, but not if it upsets car drivers. Dennis Hemsley

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  16. This broadly seems to make sense. Perhaps though Roger would like to come to Uxbridge and work out why TfL have banned buses from terminating in the large bus station for “safety reasons”, as to me at least they’ve made things worse as well as less convenient. Everyone is turfed off at the previous stop, often into the middle of the road as there is limited space for the many routes and buses also stand there. They then have to cross a busy road or the bus station roadway entrance to reach the town centre or Underground station. Meanwhile the bus runs on empty into the bus station to start the next journey or go into the garage.

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  17. Interestingly, on Google Maps, when clicking on the bus symbal adjacent to the ‘Safe Harbour’ up comes ‘Bus and coach station’. It could be the smallest bus and coach station in the country.

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  18. When I visited the Fowey in the mid 70’s with Western National the service was operated by Leyland Nationals and there was no problem encountered with the reversing of the bus.

    Paul H

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